ACRE2

[system]

After many tests we grew to like ACRE2 a lot. It still has issues but development is very active and most serious problems get a fix within a week or two. Clarke asked me to make a step-by-step tutorial on how to use ACRE2 with Arma3Sync and our repo so I decided to edit the first post with the guide. Here goes:

ACRE2 step-by-step installation guide:

1. Download and save the file from the URL provided in your ARMA3 folder, probably C:\Program Files (x86)\Steam\SteamApps\common\Arma 3
   
   
   
   
   
2. Extract the contents of the file into your Arma 3 folder (right click -> extract or double click -> drag and drop)
   
   
   
   
   
3. Go into the new @acre2 folder and take note of these folders: keys, plugin
   
   
   
4. Go into the @acre2\keys folder, copy the acre2_1_0_797.bikey into your \Arma 3\keys folder
   
   
   
5. Next go into the @acre2\plugin folder and copy acre2_win32.dll and acre2_win64.dll into your TS plugins folder, probably c:\Program Files\TeamSpeak 3 Client\plugins or c:\Program Files (x86)\TeamSpeak 3 Client\plugins
   You might have to shutdown TeamSpeak before doing this stage if you already had ACRE2 installed and enabled in the past
   
   
   
   
   
6. Load TS and go to Settings -> Plugins
   
   
   
7. Deactivate Task Force Arma 3 Radio, enable ACRE2 and make sure the version that appears on the right hand side is identical to the file that you downloaded
   
   
   
8. Go to Arma3Sync Available Addons tab and hit the Refresh button. @acre2 should appear on the list
   
   
   
9. On the right side of the Addons tab in Arma3Sync, right click somewhere in the open and create a new folder, for example TEST. Drag and drop @acre2 from the Available Addons window into the Addon Groups window. Make sure to disable TFAR inside our repo and enable ACRE2 instead
   
   

Here’s the newest ACRE2 build:
http://acre.idi-systems.com/archive/acre2_2.1.0.811.zip

[Abuk]

I like current TFAR, even if its not a perfect or super-realistic system.
It’s easier to use and not overly complicated.
I love the idea of extremely realistic and advanced radio system, but wouldn’t want it to take too much attention from the actual gameplay.

Maybe if they made casual mode that worked like TFAR and advanced mode that used all of the features, then TFAR could become obsolete.

[Xander]

I joined a session with you guys and TFAR was enabled.

Previously, I always used ACRE and ACRE2 in my arma missions, and oh boy what a change it was.

I did some more TFAR and found actually one reall positive thing about it what ACRE doesnt implement easily, switching channels.
I used to have multiple 343’s and just switch between them (and they would have each another channel)
Then, I would put one radio (squad radio) on my left ear, and the other (lead channel) on the other.
In this configuration, you also could have another one on both ears.

Another point is the directional and radio sound itself. If someone talks to the right of me, i still hear it stereo, and sometimes even more to the left.
In cars, its basically the same as ACRE, as it would have the same functionality as ‘’ Vehicle Channel’’ in vanilla arma.
This is really a big point for myself, the directional stuff.

The ‘‘advanced’’ system of ACRE, probably would be the 147 and other radio’s, which only the leaders would wear.
The 343 is actually easier than the TFAR radio that I used (I don’t know if there is a simpler one in TFAR, so im not sure about this one)

What I did find negative with my experience with ACRE, was the installation.
Before ACRE2, I had to help ALOT of people installing ACRE, but since the release of ACRE2 this was not the case for me.

As you might have noticed, im really an ACRE fanboy, haha!

Hope I contributed something to this discussion in a positive manner, this wasn’t intended as a rant against TFAR.

Cheers!

[Clarke]

[justify]I think ACRE2 has a superior direct chat to TFAR, no doubt about that. Arguably the radio distortion effects are better too.

But in most other respects TFAR is still far more stable and user friendly. The majority of mod and script creators still use TFAR as their main compatibility benchmark (F3 included), because it was the first really stable radio mod for A3. TFARs ability to switch channels with ease is handy and requires less training of Recruits.

To this day ACRE2 has some early development issues such as radio transmissions being flat out cut off by small hills and trees as well as large FPS drops when holding the radio button.

Don’t get me wrong, I like ACRE2 a lot (I was with Ryujin back in September when we switched to ACRE2 for a month), but until it leaves the development stage and reaches its first official stable release the question of leaving TFAR is renderred mute. Switching radio systems requires a lot of work: testing and scripting which can be better invested in more urgent areas for the time being. There’s no need to saddle a new horse as long as the one you’re riding is doing just fine.[/justify]

[system]

[quote user_id=“11341464” avatar=“https://assets-cloud.enjin.com/users/11341464/avatar/medium.1553522842.png” name=“Clarke”][justify]
To this day ACRE2 has some early development issues such as radio transmissions being flat out cut off by small hills and trees as well as large FPS drops when holding the radio button.[/justify][/quote]

Both issues have been solved.

But I agree, switching radio mods is a big deal. We should wait for more releases to come and for more communities to report successful transition before we follow.

[Clarke]

[justify]They have claimed to have fixed both issues several times in past changelogs. The mod is still in early development, TFAR is not. As long as broad compatibility with other mods is not a standard ACRE2 will remain something to be kept an eye on, but not a viable alternative to TFAR.

As I said I like ACRE2, but if I seem very defensive of TFAR it’s because I already went through switching to ACRE2 and back once. I won’t be giving my vote to ACRE2 again unless it’s superior to TFAR in almost every way.[/justify]

[Clarke]

Thread moved to the Suggestion Box.

[system]

I’m currently working with nkey on trying to improve TFAR.

Here’s a test Ryujin helped me record to show ACRE2’s superiority in direct speech, hopefully nkey can learn from it:

[youtube]iDzNjpyUoZQ[/youtube]

[Ryujin]

I can’t focus on how sound is perceived from me talking about physics. I keep loosing attention and focusing on the problems I’m explaining in the video.

After 9th try; I definitely like how ACRE sounds.

[Xander]

Just a question, what are the exact negative points why we don’t use it?

I mean A.C.R.E 2:

• it has superior directional speach
• it has way better distortion
• it simulates distance and hilltops with the radio’s
• the radio’s are easier to use imho

[system]

Main reasons are because it’s still in development and has bugs. When we originally tested it, it still had 1) major performance issues and 2) some environment obstacles, like bushes and trees, could make speech sound as if you’re underground or behind a wall.

These issues are solved but we can’t make the jump without making sure it’s really 100% stable. It’s not like adding or removing a sound mod - You actually have to get all the community members to update their TeamSpeak .dll plugin, get the new mod working and learn how to use it.

Regarding ease of use, I have to disagree. It’s much less user friendly when you have to use more than 1 channel as AAR/FTL/SL/Plt.CO/Pilot/MMG/MAT. There’s also no quick way to switch channels like you can in TFAR with the numpad. I found many bugs with controls and binds today while testing. Also you can’t bind a separate key per each channel/radio, here’s an example that explains how ACRE2 does it:

[quote]Let’s assume you have 3 radios. Radio 1 is set to channel 1, radio 2 is set to channel 2 and radio 3 is set to channel 3. For the sake of simplicity, I’ll use ‘chan1’ and that means ‘radio 1 channel 1’ etc.

Push PTT -> transmit chan1
Push shift+PTT -> transmit chan1
Push PTT -> transmit chan1
Push ctrl+PTT -> transmit chan2
Push PTT -> transmit chan2 (???)
Push alt+PTT -> transmit chan3 (ok starting to make sense)
Push PTT -> transmit chan3 (yep, ok we got it)

The PTT button remembers the last radio/channel you used and until you switch with shift/ctrl/alt, you continue transmitting on that net but your brain and muscle memory don’t necessarily remember. This is terrible. To avoid talking on the wrong net, I would constantly be using shift/ctrl/alt+PTT. I’m very pro-ACRE but I have to say nkey has done it far better with TFAR where you can have absolutely separate binds for each radio and don’t have to worry about talking on the wrong net as long as you remember the 2-4 binds for each channel and additional channel.[/quote]

[system]

I really liked what I heard during the ACRE testing so I wanted to make a video that I wouldn’t mind releasing to public, hopefully to get the ACRE2 developers to improve it to a point where we can convince ourselves that we can do the switch. Unfortunately, even though there’s a ton of positives, we found a lot of negatives too. ACRE2 is not ready yet.

Huge thanks to Ryujin for letting me waste his time (and apologies!) and also Shiny and Insane for hopping in.

[youtube]xmpRFEvEq4c[/youtube]

Here’s the post in the BI forum thread, expect a shitstorm!

[Ryujin]

This is so weird. In the game 3d audio positioning is so much superior with ACRE, but in video it’s not noticeable at all. TFAR handles talking from vehicles much better than ACRE. Drop-off rate is much better worked out with ACRE.

But radio usage is still… so fucked up.

btw guys, like Bull’s video on youtube, so it get’s noticed more. The video has only 3 likes…

[system]

I’m talking to jaynus and NouberNou directly but I’m failing to convince them why the ease-of-use and user-friendliness of ACRE2 is bad. If someone can help me write this up in a convincing manner, please do!

[Ryujin]

It would be much simpler if, when I press Caps Lock, I know that is my first radio. When I press CTRL+CAPS that is my second radio, SHIFT+CAPS my third… but then when I press Caps Lock alone that is my first radio back again. Much more intuitive and makes much more sense. That alone would most likely immediately consider us switching to ACRE.

That’s the best I can do.

[system]

That convinced me, but their counter argument might be this:
Their button combinations don’t just switch where you will PTT through, it changes your ‘active radio’ - which affects the result of pushing alt+shift+capslock to open the active radio. If they change the former per our request, they’ll have to overhaul the way radios are chosen, activated and opened.

[Ryujin]

All this time I was trying to remember how it was done in A2 ACRE. Back then you had to manually switch between radios if you wanted to talk over different radio. We didn’t complain, back then. Only thing that changes is that now they added the option to switch the radio and speak through it with a single key combination. Also, we changed our habits, and that is exactly what is fucking us up.

[quote name=“Back in A2”]CAPS - Speak over 343
CTRL+SHIFT+S or A - Switch radio
CAPS - Speak over 148
CTRL+SHIFT+S or A - Switch radio
CAPS - Speak over 343[/quote]

[quote name=“Now in A3”]CAPS - Speak over 343
CTRL+CAPS - Speak over 148
SHIFT+CAPS - Speak over 343[/quote]

For the same task now you can use 2 key combinations less than before. In ACRE2 you can use the old way from A2 just by ignoring the new key combinations.

[system]

OK, we’re all dumb. ._.

[quote name=“And who is stopping you to unbind the normal PTT and radio cycle keys and simply go with the MultiPTT Keys? E.g. you can bind your ALT Radio 1 Key to capslock and the other two to whatever you want.”][/quote]

That’s resulting in exactly the same functionality we get from TFAR’s binds.

He further goes to explain why it can’t be and never will be done exactly like in TFAR, you can read here if interested.

[Abuk]

The problem is not amount of radios, but lack of predefined channels switching and alternative channel functionality.

• We are using 1 radio with 2 channels + "long range" on another at max.
• There you have radios with 1 channel possibility, not split into short/long category and no predefined channel keybinds.

While they are surely developing more in-depth, they are limiting by not having those 2 things yet - alternative channels (+keybind) and fast predefined channel switch keybinds.

Edit:
Love the video, made me LOL big time

[system]

They don’t have alternative channels because these radios don’t have alternative channels in real-life.

If you read the link I posted in my previous post, you’ll understand the ‘limitation’ - which in fact is not a limitation but on the contrary - ACRE2 is the way ACRE2 is because you will be able to use 100 radios without any problem. If you only have 3 radios, you can unbind your PTT key completely and only use mutli-PTT1, multi-PTT2 and multi-PTT3 to transmit, making it ‘feel’ identical to TFAR.